Michael Smith Leaves Core 61
Donald Burr of Borg writes "Following in the footsteps of Jordan Hubbard,
Michael Smith leaves the FreeBSD core team. Reasons cited are similar to those that jkh gave, including displeasure at the bureacracy and politicking, and FreeBSD not being "fun" anymore."
Re:Awful article (Score:1)
Better too little information than Too Much [slashdot.org]!
BSD is dying.... (Score:2)
cycle; take a look at your soft, pallid bodies and consider that right
this very moment, parts of you are dying. See? It's not so bad.
The ultimate anti-troll.
BSD _is_ dying, apparently (Score:2)
I don't know what is more startling: that a core BSD member thinks "BSD is dying" trolls are worth addressing or that he seems to be saying that they're right.
Re:BSD _is_ dying, apparently (Score:2)
Re:BSD _is_ dying, apparently (Score:2, Flamebait)
Balderdash.
Slashdot's "BSD is dying" troll is notorious -- there are few people in the open-source community who haven't seen or heard of those posts. Mike's use of the troll in a rhetorical device is natural; he's simply saying that even though he and Jordan are "dying" parts of FreeBSD, FreeBSD goes on. (I suspect that his reference to the troll is also making a dig at the people he blames for making his life on core miserable by tying them to the "Slashdot crowd.")
FreeBSD is making steady progress on a variety of fronts. Mike's complaint isn't that FreeBSD itself is dying, or broken. It's that the project's governance is broken, and that far too much time is spent arguing petty matters with little effect beyond making the participants unhappy.
There is one way that Mike's leaving is a Good Thing, in that it will trigger a core election. That may go some ways toward solving the problem.
Re:BSD _is_ dying, apparently (Score:1, Interesting)
"We all know *BSD keeps losing market share but why? Is it the problematic personalities of many of the key players? Or is it larger than their troubled personalities?"
His harshest words are reserved for the "politically obsessed" and the "grandstanders, the prima donnas"
Life Moves on (Score:1, Insightful)
With the way opensource, and *BSD is spread out, the exodus of a few "core" members is not tragic. Maybe a wakeup call to get a little smoother on the politics, but that is life.
Move along folks, there is nothing of interest here, OH WAIT! Is that the *BSD is Dying troll over there? Nah, just some bozo...
Text of the email (Score:2, Informative)
ago, many of you will recall that it was after a long series of
debates during which I maintained that too much organisation, too many
rules and too much formality would be a bad thing for the project.
Today, as I read the latest discussions on the future of the FreeBSD
project, I see the same problem; a few new faces and many of the old
going over the same tired arguments and suggesting variations on the
same worthless schemes. Frankly I'm sick of it.
FreeBSD used to be fun. It used to be about doing things the right
way. It used to be something that you could sink your teeth into when
the mundane chores of programming for a living got you down. It was
something cool and exciting; a way to spend your spare time on an
endeavour you loved that was at the same time wholesome and
worthwhile.
It's not anymore. It's about bylaws and committees and reports and
milestones, telling others what to do and doing what you're told.
It's about who can rant the longest or shout the loudest or mislead
the most people into a bloc in order to legitimise doing what they
think is best. Individuals notwithstanding, the project as a whole
has lost track of where it's going, and has instead become obsessed
with process and mechanics.
So I'm leaving core. I don't want to feel like I should be "doing
something" about a project that has lost interest in having something
done for it. I don't have the energy to fight what has clearly become
a losing battle; I have a life to live and a job to keep, and I won't
achieve any of the goals I personally consider worthwhile if I remain
obligated to care for the project.
Discussion
==========
I'm sure that I've offended some people already; I'm sure that by the
time I'm done here, I'll have offended more. If you feel a need to
play to the crowd in your replies rather than make a sincere effort to
address the problems I'm discussing here, please do us the courtesy
of playing your politics openly.
From a technical perspective, the project faces a set of challenges
that significantly outstrip our ability to deliver. Some of the
resources that we need to address these challenges are tied up in the
fruitless metadiscussions that have raged since we made the mistake
of electing officers. Others have left in disgust, or been driven
out by the culture of abuse and distraction that has grown up since
then. More may well remain available to recruitment, but while
the project is busy infighting our chances for successful outreach
are sorely diminished.
There's no simple solution to this. For the project to move forward,
one or the other of the warring philosophies must win out; either the
project returns to its laid-back roots and gets on with the work, or
it transforms into a super-organised engineering project and executes a
brilliant plan to deliver what, ultimately, we all know we want.
Whatever path is chosen, whatever balance is struck, the choosing and
the striking are the important parts. The current indecision and
endless conflict are incompatible with any sort of progress.
Trying to dissect the above is far beyond the scope of any parting
shot, no matter how distended. All I can really ask of you all is to
let go of the minutiae for a moment and take a look at the big
picture. What is the ultimate goal here? How can we get there with
as little overhead as possible? How would you like to be treated by
your fellow travellers?
Shouts
======
To the Slashdot "BSD is dying" crowd - big deal. Death is part of the
cycle; take a look at your soft, pallid bodies and consider that right
this very moment, parts of you are dying. See? It's not so bad.
To the bulk of the FreeBSD committerbase and the developer community
at large - keep your eyes on the real goals. It's when you get
distracted by the politickers that they sideline you. The tireless
work that you perform keeping the system clean and building is what
provides the platform for the obsessives and the prima donnas to have
their moments in the sun. In the end, we need you all; in order to
go forwards we must first avoid going backwards.
To the paranoid conspiracy theorists - yes, I work for Apple too. No, my
resignation wasn't on Steve's direct orders, or in any way related to work
I'm doing, may do, may not do, or indeed what was in the tea I had at
lunchtime today. It's about real problems that the project faces, real
problems that the project has brought upon itself. You can't escape them
by inventing excuses about outside influence, the problem stems from
within.
To the politically obsessed - give it a break, if you can. No, the
project isn't a lemonade stand anymore, but it's not a world-spanning
corporate juggernaut either and some of the more grandiose visions
going around are in need of a solid dose of reality. Keep it simple,
stupid.
To the grandstanders, the prima donnas, and anyone that thinks that
they can hold the project to ransom for their own agenda - give it a
break, if you can. When the current core were elected, we took a
conscious stand against vigorous sanctions, and some of you have
exploited that. A new core is going to have to decide whether to
repeat this mistake or get tough. I hope they learn from our errors.
Future
======
I started work on FreeBSD because it was fun. If I'm going to
continue, it has to be fun again. There are things I still feel
obligated to do, and with any luck I'll find the time to meet those
obligations.
However I don't feel an obligation to get involved in the political
mess the project is in right now. I tried, I burnt out. I don't feel
that my efforts were worthwhile. So I won't be standing for election,
I won't be shouting from the sidelines, and I probably won't vote in
the next round of ballots.
You could say I'm packing up my toys. I'm not going home just yet,
but I'm not going to play unless you can work out how to make the
project somewhere fun to be again.
= Mike
--
To announce that there must be no criticism of the president,
or that we are to stand by the president, right or wrong, is not
only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to
the American public. - Theodore Roosevelt
Re:Text of the email (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Text of the email (Score:3, Insightful)
There is a seperation of a sort concerning this already. FreeBSD has a Release Engineering Team [freebsd.org] that handles just this kinda stuff.
Consider Linux as an example.
Although both FreeBSD and Linux share many similar philosophies and practices, you really can't compare the two in this kind of discussion. If Debian and Linux were the same thing, then you would have something to compare. This seems to get lost on folks who spend a lot of time working with Linux. The kernel, userland, packaging, pretty much the whole enchilada falls under the same project. This has a lot of positive benefits to us end user types. As we are starting to see, this also brings a lot of cooks into the same kitchen.
The 'single integrated distribution' approach of FreeBSD may produce better quality software (so the BSDers claim), but maybe it doesn't scale so well to large numbers of developers and 'town councils'.
From looking in at this from way out here on the edges I think you may be approaching the problem with the political setup. FreeBSD seems to have set up a republic of sorts without a president. Could you imagine what the US government would be like if only the congress were involved with making laws? No president, no supreme court. The entire system would be brought to a screeching halt, bogged down in committe. That, or whomever was enjoying the majority for the moment would be distorting all the laws one way or the other. It's just not a pretty picture.
Before FreeBSD should be looking at any kind of delegating any of the sub-projects, there needs to be a hard look given to the over all political structure. There's just too many folks to keep things to purely a commitee kind of thing, but not enough for a governmental style complexity. Somewhere in the middle is where things need to be. Now to see if the core team has the courage and forethought to head down that road.
OT - On the bright side... (Score:3, Interesting)
Back on topic, it is kind of sad that two respected people have left the FreeBSD core team, but things have to evolve and projects need to become somewhat dynamic rather than stay stagnant. Companies cannot survive with the same set of people on their board of directors forever either (though some wish that isn't the case).
As projects get more committers, programmers, and commenters, the harder it is to keep focused and be able to agree on the same thing. I think that Linux has shown some of the same symptoms (disagreements between how kernel patches should be handled, etc.).
Just some of my thoughts... that's all.
Thanks (Score:1)
Now seriously, thank you
Time for the younger individuals to take over? (Score:1)
Why FreeBSD? (Score:2)
Hope they finish SMPng before the project implodes - means I might finally buy a second proc for my OpenBSD machine when the code finds its way into that fork.
--saint
Re:Why FreeBSD? (Score:2, Interesting)
BSD is Dying troll (Score:1)
Big projects always involve politics (Score:1)
a big project knows and to be honest if Mike Smith
finds this a problem then he should either have
left long ago or gone and got a dose of reality
himself before he joined. You will never find a
group of homogenised drones who share the same
common view about everything even in places like
microsoft so in a freeware project such as BSD
you've got no chance of an easy life if people
disagree with something you may be doing.
People are people, you're always going to get
egotists , the ones who are always right, the ones
who like giving orders, the ones who refuse to
take responsibilty for their actions and so on.
All I can say is Welcome to The Real World Mr Smith.
Understanding issues before trying to fix them ? (Score:1)
I think it must be no easy task for core members to understand and resolve such issues. Maybe some kind of a neutral third party could look at the structure and provide positive input to help facilitate the smooth and focused operation of our entire FreeBSD team/effort ?
Or, maybe it is as simple as reiterating and refreshing the rule book (if one exists ?). This may ensure that everyone is on the same page with regards to roles, responsibilites, priorities and expectations. What do you folks think ?
Re:Understanding issues before trying to fix them (Score:1)
I don't mean this as a flame at you directly, but in this whole article theres lots of "they should do this", "appoint that", "change system".
Somehow I think its those discussions which detract most from real work.
Jason
the future of FreeBSD (Score:1)
Something must definately be wrong with this many people leaving the core team. It would be good if the remaining core team could give us a summary on where they think they are headed and then open it up to comments from the commiters and BSD users. Such a discussion may not be so useful on Slashdot , too many trolls, but perhaps a registered discussion board on FreeBSD.org would be a good way to get a bigger picture of where te core wants to take the project and where the rest of the community actually sees it going. Perhaps all the arguments that keep coming up in core discussion could be voted on in this discussion group.
This may not answer all the problems, but it would give the rest of the BSD users a better view of what is going on. It is clear that BSD is not dying, just changing. Ring out the old, ring in the new! The stable release cycle seems to be churning out more releases than ever. With the 4.6 release base already frozen and awaiting finalisation I look forward to the new release, but I look more forward to a bright future for FreeBSD.
Shouting... (Score:1)